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		<title>Kids and allowances</title>
		<link>http://wiki.grahamhillelementary.org/forum/t-69293/kids-and-allowances</link>
		<description>Posts in the discussion thread &quot;Kids and allowances&quot; - ...a roundup of opinions from a local parenting listserv</description>
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		<lastBuildDate>Mon, 06 Feb 2012 19:27:01 +0000</lastBuildDate>
		
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				<guid>http://wiki.grahamhillelementary.org/forum/t-69293#post-205195</guid>
				<title>Kids and allowances</title>
				<link>http://wiki.grahamhillelementary.org/forum/t-69293/kids-and-allowances#post-205195</link>
				<description></description>
				<pubDate>Sun, 22 Jun 2008 18:23:12 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>DeeJayK</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>58796</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>1) <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1419505165?ie=UTF8&amp;tag=grahhillelem-20&amp;linkCode=as2&amp;camp=1789&amp;creative=9325&amp;creativeASIN=1419505165" >Raising Money Smart Kids</a> by Janet Bodner has been a good resource<br /> for us. Our 7 and 8 year old get $3 each week. 10% is to be given<br /> away (church or other non-profit). The rest they choose how to<br /> spend. It is not linked to chores or behavior — rather an<br /> opportunity for them to make decisions about how to manage money.</p> <hr /> <p>2) We started about 5 ish and gave about $1.50 a week. By 10 we were<br /> giving $3.00 a week. At 12 we give $3.00 (one to save, one for<br /> charity, and one for him—now forced saving and charity) and 2-3 more<br /> dollars depending on if he has been sassy, done his morning and<br /> evening routines well, gotten to bed on time and to school without<br /> being late and kept his room cleanish. I sometimes note a plus, check<br /> or minus on the calendar for the morning and evening and we look it<br /> over together when Sunday comes and it is time for allowance.</p> <p>I know these are low rates. It is intentional. I have seen my son<br /> become amazingly good with money in the last 7 years and prior to<br /> that he just let it lie around and played with it. On trips we give<br /> him $1.00 /day sometimes a bit of a round up and we pay for ice<br /> creams, gum, etc. He buys his "things". He is reflective and makes<br /> good purchases, of course with some regrets (the learning process).<br /> We discourage taking things back.</p> <p>He has demonstrated no great tendency to go out and buy candy etc.<br /> with his money. We occasionally will split something expensive with<br /> him. He has been encouraged to work (he got paid a penny a pinecone<br /> that he picked up in our yard and even advertised and did it for<br /> someone else when he was 8—otherwise his chores are part of his<br /> responsibility). He currently is a mother's helper one day a week and<br /> uses that money plus allowance for things he wants.</p> <p>He makes money in other ways (he has several"stores" and kids love<br /> his products) but this is all for the official policy.</p> <p>I will be interested in the compile. It is a hassle to track.teaching<br /> kids about money but I think well worth it. I love the vacation<br /> policy as it has stopped his wanting everything he sees —he saves<br /> his money until he really wants something on a trip and takes the<br /> purchase seriously and loves what he buys. To me, that is success.</p> <hr /> <p>3) We have given an allowance to our 6 and 9 year old sons for about<br /> 9 months. It's a little loose in that we often forget. We give them<br /> each $2.00 a week, payday is on Saturday. I do not attach any<br /> chore/expectation to the money. We felt it was important to keep them<br /> separate so we were not using the money as motivation to do chores.<br /> It is their responsibility as members of the family to help out. I<br /> know some families who base the amount on age. I think it's unfair to<br /> pay siblings different amounts. Both of my kids have bank accounts.<br /> Ideally we'd go to the bank and deposit some of the money that sits<br /> in their piggy banks. They are unwilling to part with it, so there it<br /> sits, until they spot a new Lego product the can't live without.</p> <hr /> <p>4) We have just started this. Our six year old has to complete a set<br /> of chores to get her $6 allowance. She has only suceeded in this two<br /> times since we set it up six months ago – both times when she was<br /> highly motivated by a toy she wanted to buy. So I'd say that I don't<br /> feel like our system is working that well. I've read $1 per year of<br /> age/week and I've heard arguments on both sides of tying to chores or<br /> not. Also, some people use allowance to teach 1/3 for spending, 1/3<br /> for saving, 1/3 for charity. I think this is a good idea and maybe<br /> we'll try instituting it. I'd love to hear what other people are<br /> doing.</p> <hr /> <p>5) We just started giving our 8 yr old an allowance of $1 per week,<br /> which he gets in quarters. He has 2 banks, 1 for spending and one<br /> for saving. The deal is he has to put one quarter from every week<br /> into the savings. We make no stipulations as to what he can spend<br /> the rest on. He has done chores for a couple years now so the two<br /> are pretty unrelated.<br /> Love to hear what others are doing!</p> <hr /> <p>6) We give our child (a 7 yr old girl) 25 cent for each chore she<br /> does like feeding the dog, setting the table, loading the dishwasher<br /> etc… This does not include things that she is expected just to do<br /> like cleaning her room, picking up her toys, practicing piano… Then<br /> we tally them up at the end of the week and that is what she gets for<br /> allowance. We started about 6 months ago. She used some of her<br /> money to buy Halloween stuff at the party store and some used books<br /> at Half priced books. One of the ways we combat the entitlement<br /> issue is talking about people who are less fortunate that we are,<br /> making sure she always sends thank you notes that she made to people<br /> who have given her gifts, and tying having too much stuff to<br /> environmental issues. I hope this gives you some ideas.</p> <hr /> <p>7) We started our son out with some really small amount like $1.50 a<br /> week when he was in first grade but it wasn't enough to actually buy<br /> anything with so we heard of the $1 per year of age idea and started<br /> that awhile later. He gets to have 1/3 for spending, 1/3 goes to<br /> savings, and 1/3 goes to charity. The charity part is sent to the<br /> charity of his choice at the end of the year. The savings part we<br /> haven't been really concrete about - he can't just spend it<br /> impulsively but as long as he's had it tucked away for a couple of<br /> months we let him spend it how he'd like. He usually just forgets<br /> about it. His spending money is his to spend on whatever he wants<br /> which can be hard because he'll blow it on something really silly<br /> sometimes but that's a lesson for him to learn. It's not tied to<br /> chores - we tried that but then he thought he should always get paid<br /> for chores and we put an end to that. So chores are just part of our<br /> family routine.</p> <hr /> <p>8) I think we started allowance when our oldest son was in 2nd<br /> grade, middle was in Kindie and when youngest could put napkins on<br /> the table. We started with $1.00 a week for the boys. They are now<br /> up to $3.00, with the idea that it includes garbage &amp; occasional<br /> dishwash emptying. This is new, so it doesn't always happen. But<br /> the expectation is that they get it every week for doing normal stuff-<br /> at our house, that includes setting the dinner table, taking dishes<br /> to the sink, &amp; cleaning their room when asked . The boys do their own<br /> laundry with some coaxing, and although I help with this, they're<br /> pretty good about putting clothes away-so is my daughter. I'm not<br /> super strict about it, it seems to work most of the time.<br /> Occasionally a child will say (s)he doesn't want to do whatever, and<br /> we skip allowance that week. My oldest also does special jobs like<br /> mowing the lawn that pay $10.00(usually outside jobs).<br /> Couple of things to keep in mind-I pay on Sundays,and don't always<br /> have the right change, which makes it easy for me to forget. Also,<br /> it's helpful if when you give them money, they put it away<br /> immediately-this saves from losing money, mixing it up with someone<br /> else's, etc.<br /> Hope this is helpful-probably best to start small &amp; build.</p> <hr /> <p>9) We started allowance last year, at ages 7 and 11.<br /> ½ of age and no rounding…i.e the 11 year old got $5 and $6 when she<br /> turned twelve. Per all we read, it is definitely NOT linked to<br /> chores. That being said, all have chores…it's the small price they<br /> pay for living in a warm, wonderful home and having food, rides all<br /> the PRIVILEDGES that come with being a "wealthy" kid in the city….</p> <p>It is SO nice, because now at the toy store/dime store/coffee shop,<br /> requests can be met with "if you really want that, you can buy it<br /> with your own money". Then they HAVE to decide whether it's worth it.<br /> Interestingly, 9 times out of 10, they say no…or really think about<br /> it, and we go back and buy it another day.<br /> It has definitely reduced clutter!</p> <p>We DO NOT make them buy birthday gifts or other presents for friends.<br /> They do not buy meals..etc. We have heard of friends who do that.<br /> Seems a bit much.</p> <p>Both kids have also successfully saved for a "big ticket item"….and<br /> against "advice" we have also allowed them to buy something big, and<br /> march out the allowances they "owe" on the calendar…i.e if they don't<br /> have $12, they can get the toy, and then mark on the calendar when<br /> allowance should resume…That's not teaching good saving, but don't we<br /> all have credit cards????</p> <p>It's a good thing…tho at first, we drug our feet doing it…</p> <hr /> <p>10) Hi there, I came across this local organization a few years ago.<br /> I would include <a href="http://www.moonjar.com/" >Moonjar</a> in your compile. They have an awesome<br /> approach to helping kids understand the value of saving/spending and<br /> sharing. It is not an allowance answer but a great tool to use with<br /> allowances.</p> <hr /> <p>11) Allowances &amp; Chores (long)<br /> Our philosophy re: allowances: Our primary value/goal/purpose was<br /> to use allowances as a tool for educating our daughter about money<br /> management. The #1 comment experienced parents of young adult<br /> children told us they would change about their parenting of their<br /> kids when younger was, "We didn't do a very good job of teaching<br /> money management, setting up consequences, creating a dialogue about<br /> choices and responsibility re: spending and saving money." So we more<br /> or less created our own curriculum (and there are several excellent<br /> books for parents about all of your choices for teaching money<br /> management to your children, at all ages), which has expanded with<br /> each year.<br /> We started at age 5 — weekly allowance, payable at beginning of the<br /> week, set/negotiated annually every August before the start of the<br /> next school year. We did not tie allowances to paying for chores or<br /> behavior because this greatly complicates the accountability for<br /> money management. We chose to separate "employment [chores]<br /> supervision" from allowance pay. Our philosophy is that everyone in<br /> a family/group living situation has a responsibility to contribute to<br /> managing and caring for the home, as part of living there — not<br /> because you get paid, but because you're a member of the household.<br /> [Who pays you to wash your own dishes when you're an adult?]<br /> Allowance would always be increased every year — and, as she got<br /> older, she got better at supporting her arguments for more vs. less<br /> — i.e. what her expenses were, what our contribution should be to<br /> them vs. hers, etc. If, for example, your child pays for lunch every<br /> day at school, you can include all the costs of lunch in the<br /> allowance — this increases the $ the kid has to handle/remember/<br /> manage every day. Likewise with other regular necessities — or<br /> possibly gifts for friends' birthdays (i.e., you budget an amount<br /> and include in allowance, then give management to child).<br /> From the get-go, we required her to divide up her allowance every<br /> week, physically, into four (4) jars, according to what we had agreed<br /> would be the "budget" amount for each category: savings, charity,<br /> gifts, and personal (her "mad money" — entirely her discretion).<br /> The jars (and necessity for giving cash in proper denominations to fit<br /> into budgeted amounts in the jars) is definitely a minor<br /> administrative hassle, but excellent visual learning about what a<br /> budget "looks like." We always had a strict policy vs. loans from us<br /> (then you become a creditor and, while that can be another level of<br /> learning, we liked the philosophy of only buying when you have enough<br /> money to pay for it now). By about age 8, helped her set up an<br /> account book, in which she would write income and expenses paid out<br /> for each of these 4 accounts, checking to see if the cash in the jar<br /> equalled the written accounting. This could also be done on Quicken.<br /> For quite a few years, it was necessary for parent to sit down with<br /> her, to support/help with the written accounts. This required a great<br /> deal of parental discipline and determination to keep this up (and<br /> adolescent arguments, "None of my friends' parents make them do any<br /> of these dumb accounts!"), and sometimes difficult conversations<br /> about why we required accounting and other parents would just hand<br /> their kids cash (and usually lots of it) on a totally random basis,<br /> without any discussions at all. By about age 12 or so, we went to<br /> the bank and set up checking and savings accounts (also savings<br /> accounts designated "gifts" and "charity"), so she learned a little<br /> about bank management "the old-fashioned way." We repeatedly gave<br /> her the opportunity to have an annual clothing allowance (and 100%<br /> responsibility for all her clothing from that sum for the year), and<br /> she repeatedly declined (she probably would have rec'd more $ for<br /> clothing than we ended up buying for her) — but clothing allowance<br /> is an excellent opportunity to put a large amount of cash in the<br /> hands of your teenager, to manage (and expect that, at least for the<br /> first year, it will all be gone 6 months or less into the year, and<br /> be prepared to be tough).<br /> Our decisions and choices about the money "curriculum" haven't let<br /> up now that our daughter is in college (in fact, they continue to<br /> increase). But we did make our own decisions by the time she was in<br /> 9th grade about what our expectations/commitments would be to<br /> helping finance her college education (and we have stuck to them) —<br /> and talked about them frequently, so she would have this information<br /> clearly in her mind by the time she was making decisions about her<br /> choice of college. (This appears to be another area in which parents<br /> often don't have the crucial conversations sooner, which creates<br /> conflicts in expectations later on.) She knows what portion of her<br /> college costs/expense are her own responsibility, and she knows what<br /> we are/are not going to pay for. I think that even if we had the<br /> discretionary funds to send her $300 per month for her own personal<br /> "mad money" at college now, we wouldn't choose to do that. And now<br /> the conversations just continue on additional issues — credit card<br /> management, credit card solicitations, debit cards, advance planning,<br /> segregating your book budget from the year from your latte budget,<br /> evaluating good/bad choices made, accounting and more accounting.</p> <p>Re: chores (separate from allowance): At age 6, each year — we<br /> discussed and negotiated every August (separate from allowance<br /> meeting) what our daughter's new house chore/job would be for the<br /> coming year. Then each year, the new chore would be added to the<br /> chores she had been doing in the past. First year/chore, we assigned<br /> table setting. Then added table clearing and loading the dishwasher.<br /> Then added washing all the cooking dishes that don't go in<br /> dishwasher. About then we started giving her 3-4 choices of her new<br /> chore for the coming year — complete with job description<br /> (frequency, what needed to be done) — and she'd choose which one to<br /> add on. [We were amazed when she chose cleaning the bathrooms every<br /> 2 weeks to doing weekly garbage, which we thought was an easier,<br /> less time-consuming job. But she totally got into doing bathrooms,<br /> and has really learned how to do it right — a great life skill.<br /> More amazement when she chose vacuuming over garbage.] So by the<br /> time she went to college, she has a complete skill set of basic tasks<br /> required to care for a home — and contribute to the family.<br /> Just keep asking what your own behavior is teaching your child, at<br /> whatever age. Just like every other choice we make as parents. [And,<br /> reflect back on how your parents taught (or didn't teach) you money<br /> management — and what your own issues are with money not that you're<br /> an adult, what your own strengths &amp; weaknesses are.]</p> <hr /> <p>12) We plan to give our 7 year old $3.50/week ($0.50 per year of<br /> age). We are treating this as more of a salary than a direct chores-<br /> for-cash idea. Basically, as a member of this household, your job is<br /> to do things around the house. As a member of this household, you<br /> also get spending money. We aren't going to have specific penalties -<br /> given his personality, I worry about him saying "fine, dock my pay, I<br /> don't want to do that chore". I know that's what I would've done :-<br /> ). We do have a chore chart as a guideline (he's only 7 - we want<br /> to make sure he's reminded somehow :-)), but he knows that he has<br /> other responsibilities that aren't listed - some things we will ask<br /> him directly, and some he may take it upon himself to do. We were<br /> against the idea of just handing over money without any<br /> responsibility tied to it, since that's not how things really are in<br /> the world, and we want him to have some kind of a work ethic and to<br /> realize "hey, I worked hard for this, I'm going to be careful with<br /> it".</p> <p>As for charity, we are leaving that out of the allowance equation for<br /> now, but we are going to have him go through his toys for toy drives,<br /> and we've always talked to him about how important it is to give in<br /> some way. We'll definitely continue to include him in that. I'm not<br /> worried about a separate savings account just yet - he's such a<br /> squirrel, he's going to save most of it for longer term goals anyway<br /> (he piddled away money that he got at the beginning of the summer and<br /> I think he likes the fact that he can save up). We've had a moonjar<br /> for each kid for years (<a href="http://www.moonjar.com/" >www.moonjar.com</a>),<br /> but haven't used it. I'm sure that will be incorporated somehow later.</p> <p>We'll still be getting birthday presents for his friends, and we'll<br /> still have outings that we'll pay for. This is for extra stuff that<br /> we wouldn't normally get for him. We still have the right to veto<br /> what he gets, of course (no 5 pound bags of candy or MA video games :-<br /> )). If he's saved for a long time for something big, we will pay the<br /> sales tax for him (which here, is almost 9%).</p> <p>We haven't fine-tuned this yet, but we would also would like to have<br /> him, at allowance time, tell us why he thinks that he should get his<br /> allowance. We figure beefing up the verbal skills isn't a bad<br /> thing. He could use his chore chart as a tool, and use it as an<br /> opportunity to tell us things that we may not have noticed ("I didn't<br /> pick up my toys yesterday because I was helping my sister get her<br /> show-and-tell for school."). We may decide to award a bonus to<br /> his "salary" depending on the week that he had. I really also wanted<br /> the idea of adding a "random act of kindness" to his chore chart, but<br /> I never want that to be forced or paid for directly. I like the idea<br /> of a special "chore jar" for when he wants to earn extra money -<br /> stuff that we don't expect him to do but can handle, like pulling<br /> weeds and filling the yard waste container.</p> 
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